Convicted Driver Insurance Quotes

Next steps with the insurance

ZZTopWereHere

Well-known member
#1
Hi all,

While my case is discussed in the thread http://www.forum.drinkdriving.org/have-you-been-caught-convicted-drink-driving/79800.htm, I'm starting this new thread to cover my concerns regarding what to do with my insurance when I'll be sentenced soon (if you don't want to read my whole other thread, I blew 47 with no prior criminal or road-related offense and I'm expecting at least a 9-month ban taking a rehab training).

I have double checked, and indeed my insurance questionnaire included two specific questions related to drink driving, and the answers (no and no) will most definitely not apply anymore after the court hearing. Therefore, at least to leave my car insured against theft while parked, I will have to update my insurance after the hearing because the contract is breached if the original conditions do not apply anymore.

In the meantime, the only positive side of my incident is that my wife asked for a provisional licence and will start taking driving lessons soon. She wanted to take a driving licence also to broaden her employment opportunities but we've never prioritised this as much as we're clearly doing now. Soon we'll be left with a car that no one would be entitled to drive.

Currently I believe that the best course of actions once my wife will start her lessons would be to transfer the car insurance to her altogether. There might still be a premium for a learner/new driver but it should be still better than a DR10 person that anyway won't be able to drive the car for months.

Eventually, when my ban will be over, the ideal epilogue would be to have the insurance cover both of us, so that I can actually start driving again.

Therefore I'm envisioning three stages:

1) Parked car with updated insurance in my name to play honest with the insurance and have at least the car covered against theft.
2) Car covered under my wife's name and no mention of myself, I'll be just a passenger.
3) My name added to my wife's name to be able to drive both when I'll be over my ban.

Here are my questions, as I haven't seen a thread discussing this specific sequence of actions:

A) At stage 1, should I expect an immediate premium increase or, given that I can't drive anyway and therefore I don't increase, but rather decrease, any risk factor, will it just be a formality with no additional cost?
B) At stage 2, is it straightforward to "swap names" or is it really a matter of terminating my current contract and start a fresh one?
C) At stage 3, should I expect a premium increase equivalent to having the insurance in my name or would the final premium be an average between me and my wife considering that she'll have a clean record?
D) Is my plan feasible/reasonable or would there be some better course of action to take given my condition?
E) Is my plan based on any wrong assumption?

Thanks in advance for your feedback and sorry if I missed any similar thread, I'm happy to read other posts if my questions are already answered.

Thanks and best regards,
Z
 

ZZTopWereHere

Well-known member
#2
Hello,

Probably my post was too long and/or slightly off topic in this forum, but hopefully someone will chime in.

I'm still waiting for the hearing but in the meantime I thought it would be easier/wiser to step straight into stage 2) and just wait for my wife to get a provisional licence which she has already applied for.

Is there anyone who went through the process of moving the insurance cover for the car to his/her partner/spouse/significant other?

Thanks in advance for your feedback,
Z
 
#3
Can you clarify who actually owns the car, and who will be supervising her as a provisional licence holder?
 

ZZTopWereHere

Well-known member
#4
Hi Price,

Thanks a lot for your reply.

I own the car and a driving instructor would be supervising my wife. Clearly I wouldn't be able to take that role until my driving ban will be over.

Actually she'll mostly learn with a car from the driving school with a manual gearbox as ours is automatic, but ideally she could have a few lessons at the end using our car so that she'll become acquainted to that one too.

We understood, and it makes sense, that if someone learns only with an automatic car then the licence will be limited to that type of car. That's why we'd like her to take the "full" manual licence.

Do you see any issue with these plans?

Thanks again,
Z
 

ZZTopWereHere

Well-known member
#5
Hello again,

I've done some "homework" about the insurance topic by reviewing similar topics here and my concerns and options have changed quite significantly.

My original post appears to be not applicable for multiple reasons:

  • It appears that a banned driver can not be insured. While I haven't found any law or regulation about this, the most common reaction of insurances to the notification of a ban is first to cancel the insurance and I'd like first to have a decent "migration plan" towards my wife in order to avoid a plain cancellation and a brand new search for insurers.
  • Sometimes insurances might not accept a main driver who's not the owner, or anyway they might require the owner to be insured. Hence, from the statement above, I should move the car ownership to my wife.
  • Even if my wife were accepted as the only driver of my car, the police might stop her over and over due to the registration plate being recognized as related to a car owned by a banned driver. I could even add, but maybe it's just me having nightmares, that if she were driving and I were in the passenger seat while being the owner, I might be suspected of intending to drive the car while banned. After all this ordeal I don't want even a single parking ticket, which was my only offense in the past 10 years while driving cars in multiple countries.
Therefore the most sensible option, which I didn't take into account at all earlier on, would be to transfer the property of my car to my wife. This, however, leads to a whole set of new questions mostly OT here. I am still paying for the car with a complex contract with Toyota and I'm not sure how the whole change of ownership might impact any existing sales agreement. My insurance is also with Toyota, the whole set up was really aimed at simplicity but I'm now concerned about a "domino effect" across all my Toyota agreements.

I could even contemplate a SORN period, but I do not have any garage. My house is on a street which is marked as "private land" and parking should be restricted to people living in that street, but actually the street is publicly accessible so it's at best a gray area and I wouldn't want my car to be removed by the police because it's on a street while on SORN too.

Even if changing owner turns out to be relatively simple, timing appears still to be crucial. I'm not sure if my wife can have a car while having just a provisional licence or if she needs to pass the test first.

I guess most of my doubts are now unrelated to my driving ban, but it seems that a lot of other people, especially those having/expecting bans around a single year, had similar concerns so I'd still appreciate feedback here.

I will do further research on switching car owners as this is something I've never done so far anywhere, and any comment or hint is more than welcome.

Thanks again,
Z
 

ZZTopWereHere

Well-known member
#6
Hi all,

After reading http://www.forum.drinkdriving.org/general-discussion/28723.htm it seems again that all options are on the table really.

Basically it seems to boil down to rules changing from insurance to insurance, I haven't yet found anything in terms of laws forbidding anything beyond driving while banned and having an uninsured car in a public area.

When I'll get out of the court next week I will first contact the Toyota sales people and only later I will contact the insurance, I'm honestly expecting some more support from sales than from the insurance in my case.

I will then update everyone here because, even if it looks like a website from the mid 90s, this forum is a great resource and I'm truly thankful to all people maintaining it and providing help to a lot of people who face a struggle like a driving ban for the first and most likely the last time in their life.

If only I had considered all the collateral damage earlier on... but I have to look ahead and steer clear from driving any car even for a whole day after a party the night before.

Thanks again,
Z
 
#7
[h=3]You are right that it can depend on the individual insurance company, here is a quote from the Admiral insurance website:

You are To insure my car, do I need to be the registered keeper?[/h]The policyholder and the registered keeper may be different, but only providing the registered keeper is the policyholder's spouse/partner. Otherwise the policyholder and registered keeper must the same person.


But Swiftcover say they will insure a vehicle, providing the policy holder is not the spouse of the person who wants insurance....
(Sorry, that will not cut and paste)

You are right that as soon as you inform Toyota insurance, they are likely to cancel the policy. This can cause you a problem because when you go to be insured next time, you will be asked if you "have ever had a policy of insurance cancelled" this will carry additional premiums, or quite possibly a refusal to insure. That does not apply, however, if you ring up yourself and cancel the insurance policy.
That leads to your next problem, your vehicle is on a road or public place and therefore must be insured all the time.
You therefore have to have an alternative plan before you tell the insurance company. I do not think it would be a good idea to have your wife drive the car, because it is an automatic. You are right that if she passes a test in a manual, she can drive either type, but to be learning to drive in both types at the same time would be very confusing for her and you may well find that a driving instructor would refuse to give her lessons in an automatic whilst she is having formal lessons in his manual (dual control) driving school car.
Now to the Toyota finance angle..... Who actually owns the vehicle? You will have to look at the paperwork, and probably ask Toyota. Is the vehicle registered in their name, with you as the owner when you have paid in full? Is it registered to you, as the owner, but the finance recorded against it, which means that it cannot be sold until it is paid off? Is the finance dependant on you having insurance, or only Toyota insurance?
i would ask the garage those questions NOW, not after you are banned, to give a few more days to put something in place.

in law, your wife can be the registered keeper of a vehicle with a provisional title, but you have to work your way through the legalities of ownership as it stands now, to see if ownership can be transferred to her. I would not be to worried about insuring it for her to drive, for the reasons I gave above her driving it is likely to be some time in the future, as is your driving. (sorry to rub that in)
i think your best bet, providing ownership by Toyota is not an obstacle, is to approach an Insurance broker rather than individual companies, put the situation to them and see what they come up with for insurance for your wife as the 'keeper' of the vehicle, owned by you as spouse. Say you want it to start the day of your court appearance and after court ring Toyota insurance to cancel that policy. That way you have continuous cover and you have not had a policy declined for when you want to be added to the policy in 9 months time....... But don't have her drive the car while she is learning!
One last think, you cannot be in trouble for being the passenger in a car whilst disqualified. (unless you are supervising a learner) you are either driving or you are not, thinking of driving or having the opportunity of driving is not disqualified driving.
 

ZZTopWereHere

Well-known member
#8
Thanks Price, as usual you provide great feedback.

I have checked the relevant legalese in my docs and I'm sure that:

  • I am already the owner
  • The insurance policy would not even cover a theft if at the time of the incident I am disqualified from driving
    • The contract mentions, under the "General Exclusions" section and the title "There is no cover:" the following condition: "Where at the time of the Insured Incident You were disqualified from driving (...)".
  • I am expected to notify the insurance on changes about my details reported when agreeing to the insurance contract
    • In an "Important Information" section there is the following statement: "Your policy is based on the answers you gave on the statement of insurance and any other information you gave us. You must tell us of any changes to the answers you have given".

So, the good news is that I am the owner and so it should be even easier to talk first to the sales/finance people.

The bad news is that, given the current contract, even a theft while I'm asleep at home would not be a covered "Insured Incident". Probably I would be covered in terms of having an insured vehicle for the purposes of the law, but the insurance would not give me a single pound if I don't see anymore the car where I parked it the day before my court hearing.

It's also quite obvious that they expect notification of changes but as you suggested I'm better have a "plan B" before my update to them.

I've not had a great experience with brokers when I was shopping for insurance when I bought my car, considering that I had no UK history as a driver I was quoted ridiculous amounts (in hindsight, probably similar to what I will get as soon as I'll be over with my ban) while Toyota was better than any other insurer I could find online.

Tomorrow I'll call my Toyota sales contact and ask them for advice.

I'll update this post with any progress I make. It's amazing how every single case here has somehow a unique twist, but the more we share, the more we can find mutual help regarding each hurdle we have to deal with.

Thanks again,
Z
 

ZZTopWereHere

Well-known member
#9
Hi all,

I've spoken with the Toyota sales people and they've been of some help, even though unfortunately the individual I spoken to never came across another similar case.

  1. He confirmed that I am the legal owner of the car and a change of registered owner is something between me and DVLA. The financing agreement would not have to be changed and I'll keep on paying them (Toyota finance) back for the car regardless of the registered owner on the DVLA side.
    • Changing ownership should save my wife from being stopped by police cars recognising the plate as registered to a disqualified driver. Moreover, it should help when transferring the insurance to my wife.
  2. He can't speak for the insurance (sales, finance and insurance are three distinct businesses within the group), and beyond mentioning the increased cost to cover a driver on a provisional licence, he said I can only discuss my options with the insurance.
I will now check how to sort out the DVLA portion, but I'm still quite tense and unsure about what to do with the insurance. Their quote and conditions, apart from the obvious bit on disqualified drivers, were good and I have no real reason now to change insurance and start from scratch searching for a new insurer. Cancelling the contract upfront would not give me the opportunity to evaluate if there is actually a smoother alternative to let my wife drive our car as soon as she'll be able to.

Should I start a "what if" discussion with the insurance prior to my disqualification becoming effective next week, or could they cancel the contract promptly even before me being disqualified? I still want to use the car this weekend...

Thanks and best regards,
Z
 

ZZTopWereHere

Well-known member
#10
Hi all,

While waiting for my hearing on Monday, I thought about yet another option with my wife, i.e. adding one of her uncles to my insurance as a clean driver. He could also be the one helping my wife when she'll be on a provisional licence later on (it should be another week or two).

I do want to notify my insurance ASAP after my conviction, but I do want to suggest options upfront to find a way to fix my contract rather than looking for a new one.

I'll report later on if my plans turn out to be successful or not.

Thanks and best regards,
Z
 
#11
You may still find that if the vehicle is still registered to you, that your insurance company will still cancel the policy if all that is on the policy to legally drive is 2 named drivers, not the policyholder, so you would still have to have your wife as the policy holder, which would mean a new policy.
 

ZZTopWereHere

Well-known member
#12
Hello again,

I went past also the second hurdle!

After a better than expected result in court, I must now praise Toyota Insurance for their flexibility. The Toyota shop sales people were less helpful/creative than I hoped for, so they have just suggested me to contact the insurance.

I was pretty tense today as I was going to explain my "plan B" to the insurance call centre operators. They were not very kind and nice in terms of tone of voice, which got me worried initially, but in the end it was probably just for the stress due to all the calls they have to answer.

They have amended my existing policy for the negligible amount of £12, adding my wife with her provisional licence that we received on the day when we got back home from the court (perfect timing), and adding her uncle who has a nice and clean UK licence since about 15 years ago.

I'm still waiting for them to answer a few questions via email (for instance they've mistakenly reported 9 points on my licence beyond my 9 months disqualification while clearly my offence does not involve any points, probably it's just the result of hasty typing), but the car is still insured and my wife will be able to use it when her uncle will be available prior to her final test, or when she will have passed her test. She will learn driving with some professional instructor with a manual transmission car while ours is automatic, but we'll soon buy our "L" sign to let her test our car even while she learns how to drive (as long as an instructor or her uncle will help).

Long story short: always look at the bright side of life, as Monty Python used to sing... now we'll see what happens with my US visa, the third and final hurdle. That's where my optimism is at its lowest, our confidence prior to this incident led us to delay the process but now timing is quite critical. We'll see, I still want to go through all the steps because otherwise I will never know and I would only be left with an eternal doubt that no one could answer except the pessimists and the optimists.

Thanks and best regards,
Z
 
Last edited:

ZZTopWereHere

Well-known member
#13
Hello again,

More good news to share:


  1. My wife passed her driving test over a month ago and with a further marginal payment we could update our Toyota policy so that she can drive with her new driving licence. I was worried that the police might have stopped us over and over due to the registration plate being mapped to a convicted driver but we've not been stopped once so far.
  2. At renewal time I was worried that the quote from Toyota would have skyrocketed to ridiculous prices considering both my conviction and the new licence of my wife but luckily the price was comparable to the estimates obtained while doing my DD course. The quote was slightly over 1K £, pretty high by UK standards and about 300 pounds above last year's quote but all insurances contacted during the DD course were expecting the quote to be around 1000 pounds anyway. Although with other insurance companies I might have shaved off a few dozen pounds, I wanted also to reward Toyota Insurance for their supportive attitude through my ordeal.
  3. I'm now less than two months away from being able to drive again in the UK.

Thanks again everyone for your support.

Best regards,
Z
 
Buy CDT Test
Top