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Nightmare that keeps getting worse - Admiral

dd1979

Member
Hi everyone


Been lurking here since I was banned for 24 months (reduced to 18 with course) last June following the accident last May. This is my first post.

To cut a long story short, I hit another vehicle on may way home having met my estranged wife to discuss our separation (things didn't go well during that discussion and my decision to drive home afterwards was one I will forever regret). Thankfully no-one was hurt, badly, but it was still enough to cause a fair amount of damage to both cars, apparent whiplash to the other vehicle's occupants, and a night in the slammer for yours truly.

I paid a huge fine and got away without a community order owing largely to my unfortunate family circumstances. But since then the punishment has become so much worse.

The events of last May have gone on to see me become ostracised by some family and several friends, eventually (after a lot of initial employer support) lose my job as news became public among the management, damage to future job prospects due to word of the incident getting around the industry within which I work, and the ignominy that I can't even pick my kids up from school (on foot) without feeling the shame and overhearing the gossip. I have paid over £5k to fix a car I don't own, owing to Admiral not covering me following my admission that I was over the limit.

And, last week, I had the email from them that I had been dreading.

I really need some guidance on what to do following their indemnity letter. I've seen posts on here advising of the course of action to take, but can't get my head straight at a time I have a hundred and one other issues to deal with, not least which direction to take regarding future employment (which, temporarily, I have been able to secure).

I'd be grateful to hear of anyone who has been in the same situation with Admiral. The thought of the loss is keeping me awake at night and could financially destroy everything I have.

Thank you
DD
 

Tess1234

Member
Hi DD
I’m sorry you’ve had such rough time of it. You aren’t alone. It’s a sad state of affairs that drink driving often follows a spate of personal crisis.
I’m in the same situation with admiral. I’m a waiting for the indemnity form.
I don’t plan on signing it and will seek legal advice when it arrives. I will also be pushing for a clear and transparent breakdown of all costs that admiral have paid and evidence that they have tried to keep costs to a minimum. I want photos, receipts, copies of absolutely everything. Then I will decide if I feel they’ve acted in the best interests of me (knowing full well they won’t have) and go from there.
I won’t be signing my life away nor be bullied by them.
I will be responding to everything via post with a second class stamp and recorded delivery on everything.
From what I can gather they have six years from the date of the accident to take me to court.
I intend to drag this out for as long as possible. It will be stressful and involve a lot of paperwork but that’s what I’m doing.
What I did was wrong, I’m deeply ashamed and the third party should be compensated - all of which I agree with. I have and am being punished by the law.
I don’t agree with admiral clawing the costs back when I was insured. Don’t pay out for my costs but it’s unethical (in my mind) for them as a multi million pound company to perform there own version of justice.
I know it’s a horrible situation but please keep your head up and stay calm. Speak to CAB or seek legal advice from a civil lawyer.
 

dd1979

Member
Hi Tess

Thanks for your reply.

I haven't yet replied to them to ask for a break-down of costs. I think my first step is to talk to CAB. I can't afford to spend any more money on lawyers.

DD
 

AlanT73

Well-known member
What I did was wrong, I’m deeply ashamed and the third party should be compensated - all of which I agree with. I have and am being punished by the law.
I don’t agree with admiral clawing the costs back when I was insured. Don’t pay out for my costs but it’s unethical (in my mind) for them as a multi million pound company to perform there own version of justice.
Playing devil's advocate, you agree that the 3rd party should be compensated but not by you (even though you were driving whilst in contradiction of the terms of your insurance policy, thus voiding it)

Who should foot the bill in that case? It's nothing to do with a company performing their own form of justice. Insurance companies are businesses who's main purpose is to return a profit. If the insurance company foots the bill then this is passed on to every policy holder in the form of an increase in premium. Those policy holders would no doubt say that this is unethical.
 

dd1979

Member
I don’t plan on signing it and will seek legal advice when it arrives. I will also be pushing for a clear and transparent breakdown of all costs that admiral have paid and evidence that they have tried to keep costs to a minimum. I want photos, receipts, copies of absolutely everything. Then I will decide if I feel they’ve acted in the best interests of me (knowing full well they won’t have) and go from there.
I won’t be signing my life away nor be bullied by them.
One thing that is quite clear in their letter is that they will not seek to challenge any costs unless I instruct them to act on my behalf. If I do nothing they won't do anything until an unsatisfied judgment is is obtained against me. By which time there will have been no active intervention on their part to challenge or minimise any costs. So it all seems very chicken and egg indeed.
 

Tess1234

Member
Why don’t all insurance companies operate the same stance then?
As I said above I’m in no way condoning my actions and the third party should be compensated. I was insured fully comprehensive.
A lot of people speed, drive dangerously, use a mobile phone when driving and cause accidents as a result. Why don’t admiral chose to come after these people also?
Before the incident I’d never had so much as a parking ticket and was a safe driver.
What I did was awful and unforgivenable to people who have suffered and lost loved ones as a result of DD. I completely understand that but I feel what admiral are is questionable at the least.
 

AlanT73

Well-known member
Why don’t all insurance companies operate the same stance then?
As I said above I’m in no way condoning my actions and the third party should be compensated. I was insured fully comprehensive.
A lot of people speed, drive dangerously, use a mobile phone when driving and cause accidents as a result. Why don’t admiral chose to come after these people also?
It's a fair point. Probably a question for the motor insurance industry. Also a good reason to check the policy details on what is and what is not covered.

On your second point on speeding, dangerous driving and mobile phone use. Insurance companies will accept dashcam footage of and leading up to an incident. If these offences can be proved, the insurance companies involved will share the information to indicate where fault lies and apportion bl;ame accordingly. Some even offer a discount for owners of dashcams.

I own a fairly high performance car and since I had a camera installed (more specifically the sticker in the back window that states the fact) instances of stupid 'envy overtakes' and cut ups reduced to almost zero. The odd one I do experience gets uploaded to the local police force for appropriate action.
 

Tess1234

Member
One thing that is quite clear in their letter is that they will not seek to challenge any costs unless I instruct them to act on my behalf. If I do nothing they won't do anything until an unsatisfied judgment is is obtained against me. By which time there will have been no active intervention on their part to challenge or minimise any costs. So it all seems very chicken and egg indeed.
That inself is wrong.
So they expect you to sign your life away and leave yourself open to a potentially unlimited bill and they won’t give any figures or details before hand?
I shall be in no way disputing the T&Cs and advising that I’m not refusing to pay but before I commit myself to any payback I want evidence and paperwork confirming how said amount was reached.
 

dd1979

Member
Maybe it is. Have 2 weeks to go now until I need to repsond eitherway, and still have no clue what to do.

I 'chatted' with an online advisor at the CBA; apparently they don't do traditional appointments any more or at least so I am told. But, in any case, even if they did I'm unsure that the advice I would receive would be any different from the online advisor's attempt to clarify a letter and the implications therein that I already fully understand. What I want to know is if there are sufficient grounds to challenge or ignore what on one hand could be construed as a very threatening, ominous letter advising of a very grave situation, but could just as easily be construed as a sales pitch on behalf of Admiral and the MIB. I wish that there was an expert in this field whom I could talk to - most solicitors I can find who specialise in DUI cases seem only interested in discussing the possibility (or at least selling you idea of) getting you off the charge in the first place. And if divorce has taught me anything, it's that generally they do better out of it than anyone else.
 
Is there any update on this? I have a similar situation. I didn’t sign the indemnity form but my insurance are paying out and said they will come after me. Thanks guys.
 

Depressed Dad

Well-known member
Is there any update on this? I have a similar situation. I didn’t sign the indemnity form but my insurance are paying out and said they will come after me. Thanks guys.
Your insurer is paying out because they are legally obliged to settle the third party claim, irrespective of a DD conviction.
In a non-DD claim they'll just stump up the money and unlikely to challenge the costs unless they are blatantly wrong.

It's easier and cheaper to not challenge. All the insurers do the same so I suppose it evens itself out. That's all well and good when the costs are paid by the insurance company, you just don't need to worry about it. The claim in my sons case was settled way before they came after him so the threat about signing the indemnity form before they challenge seems a little hollow.

When the insurer decides to recoup the money from you personally it soon becomes apparent how inefficient and inept the whole process is.
That's where you need to challenge everything. They make stupid mistakes like sending us the name and address of the other party - breaking data privacy laws. Make of note of all of it and point it out to them.

I see many people pleading for help. I have been contacted numerous times. Unfortunately I very rarely see the outcome of their case. Some will agree a reduced figure and a payment plan. Others like me went quiet for long periods to help the 6 years pass without stirring up Admiral's attention.

It would be good if people seeking help do come back and explain what happened to them.
 
Your insurer is paying out because they are legally obliged to settle the third party claim, irrespective of a DD conviction.
In a non-DD claim they'll just stump up the money and unlikely to challenge the costs unless they are blatantly wrong.

It's easier and cheaper to not challenge. All the insurers do the same so I suppose it evens itself out. That's all well and good when the costs are paid by the insurance company, you just don't need to worry about it. The claim in my sons case was settled way before they came after him so the threat about signing the indemnity form before they challenge seems a little hollow.

When the insurer decides to recoup the money from you personally it soon becomes apparent how inefficient and inept the whole process is.
That's where you need to challenge everything. They make stupid mistakes like sending us the name and address of the other party - breaking data privacy laws. Make of note of all of it and point it out to them.

I see many people pleading for help. I have been contacted numerous times. Unfortunately I very rarely see the outcome of their case. Some will agree a reduced figure and a payment plan. Others like me went quiet for long periods to help the 6 years pass without stirring up Admiral's attention.

It would be good if people seeking help do come back and explain what happened to them.
Thank you depressed dad. I have read all of your comments in different threads and you have been really helpful. I think the onbudsmen case was also yours.
I cannot believe that there is not one single reported case on this matter. The insurer contacted me this week by phone to discuss not signing the indemnity and mentioned CCJs. They said they had a 3rd party claim (I hit a barrier, nobody else was involved). They refused to tell me how much the claim was for but they said “we will recoup it from you”. I asked again what the claim was and they said “we want to manage your expectations”. I then asked how long it would be before I knew how much and he said “months”. It’s all very very unsettling in what is already a stressful situation. It happened in April.
Thanks again for your reply.
 

Depressed Dad

Well-known member
OK, the claim against you sounds a lot more straightforward than my sons case which involved personal injury claims, car hire, car repairs etc .

I'm guessing the Highways Agency or a local council will fix the barrier and pass the costs onto the insurer. Probably very little to challenge and the insurer will pay up without question then seek the money from you.

A CCJ (County Court Judgment) is not a good thing to have and needs to be avoided. However, any mention of CCJs at this point in proceedings is just a threat to encourage you to be compliant and do what they ask.

A CCJ against you only comes from you losing a civil court case, or them winning by default if you ignore it and don't turn up to defend yourself. So do not ignore any official court papers. Sounds like you are months away from court proceedings if they don't yet know the costs. Depends how much the claim is but it doesn't cost much to take someone to a civil court and there is a strict process for them to follow.
In some cases you could also end up having to pay legal costs but again there are strict rules that apply and in some cases they can't ask for costs.

I haven't understood what difference signing the indemnity makes, other then you admitting liability which plays into the insurers hands. My son signed it but it didn't make any difference to the insurer helping to reduce the cost of the claim.

You will get plenty of notice of court proceedings and you will have opportunity to agree a settlement before you end up in court.

You could sit back and wait for the details of the claim before deciding how to play it. Unless the cost of fixing the barrier is unrealistic you may find your only option is to agree a repayment plan. I have no doubt the insurer will be asking how much you earn and what your outgoings are. You might not want to share that information with them and there isn't a legal obligation as far as I know. That information can only be legally obtained through the court process which is some way off.

I'm not a legal expert so you might want to have a chat with a solicitor or other legal expert to get proper advice. Make sure you understand the difference between the insurer twisting your arm and actually following the recovery process through the courts. They are two very different things.
 
OK, the claim against you sounds a lot more straightforward than my sons case which involved personal injury claims, car hire, car repairs etc .

I'm guessing the Highways Agency or a local council will fix the barrier and pass the costs onto the insurer. Probably very little to challenge and the insurer will pay up without question then seek the money from you.

A CCJ (County Court Judgment) is not a good thing to have and needs to be avoided. However, any mention of CCJs at this point in proceedings is just a threat to encourage you to be compliant and do what they ask.

A CCJ against you only comes from you losing a civil court case, or them winning by default if you ignore it and don't turn up to defend yourself. So do not ignore any official court papers. Sounds like you are months away from court proceedings if they don't yet know the costs. Depends how much the claim is but it doesn't cost much to take someone to a civil court and there is a strict process for them to follow.
In some cases you could also end up having to pay legal costs but again there are strict rules that apply and in some cases they can't ask for costs.

I haven't understood what difference signing the indemnity makes, other then you admitting liability which plays into the insurers hands. My son signed it but it didn't make any difference to the insurer helping to reduce the cost of the claim.

You will get plenty of notice of court proceedings and you will have opportunity to agree a settlement before you end up in court.

You could sit back and wait for the details of the claim before deciding how to play it. Unless the cost of fixing the barrier is unrealistic you may find your only option is to agree a repayment plan. I have no doubt the insurer will be asking how much you earn and what your outgoings are. You might not want to share that information with them and there isn't a legal obligation as far as I know. That information can only be legally obtained through the court process which is some way off.

I'm not a legal expert so you might want to have a chat with a solicitor or other legal expert to get proper advice. Make sure you understand the difference between the insurer twisting your arm and actually following the recovery process through the courts. They are two very different things.
Thanks again for the response and guidance. I will let you know the result although it sounds like this will be going on for some time.
 
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