A QUESTION FOR PRICE1367

Convicted Driver Insurance
DVA seem to be administrators of basic procedures and not able to give advice with any degree of certainty whatsoever. But this doesn't stop them giving wrong advice either. Would you know of any department in Coleraine that I could contact directly for an absolute definitive answer to my query John? I'm fed up dealing with guessers.
 
Chris,
I would wait to see what "the guy who should know" to ring you tomorrow, then, as you have rightly asked today, get them to put it in writing.
They must have come across this before?
i do not have a direct contact at Coleraine, but if you do not get a definitive answer tomorrow, let me know and I will enquire about the best person would be.
 
John
I spoke to the "guy in the know" today. He took advice from another internal expert and here is the reply I got:

"Following our discussion today, and in response to your emails, I apologise for the confusion caused and I will now give you a definitive answer to your questions.

You will be required to do tests for both the car and motorcycle after being disqualified until tested (DUT). The reason for this can be found in the Motor Vehicles (Driving Licenses) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 1996, regulation 35(4) which states:

(4) Where the person who is disqualified passes the practical test on a vehicle of a class included in category B the disqualification shall be deemed to have expired additionally in relation to all classes of vehicle included in—
(a)categories B + E, C, C + E, D and D + E unless that test is passed on a vehicle with automatic transmission, in which case the disqualification shall be deemed to have expired only in relation to such classes of motor vehicle included in those categories as have automatic transmission; and
(b)categories F, G, H, K, L and P.
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/nisr/1996/542/regulation/35/made

Whilst this does not directly state that Category A (motorcycle) is not re-instated it does state the additional categories for which the disqualification ends when Category B (car) is passed, and the motorcycle is not shown. Therefore by it's omission it is deemed to be not included.

As for your question about what you have to do to get the full motorcycle back I can confirm that you will be required to complete all elements of the training as if you never held the licence before. This means the Theory test, CBT, Off-road test and On-road test."
 
Chris,
I have now had time to read the legislation quoted, and I have to disagree with their take on it.
what they have quoted is only a part of the relevant legislation.... Below is what the full section 35 says, note 35(1) b and 35 (3) that both seem to indicate the it relates to ALL classes that you previously held on your licence,
They quote sub section 35(4) which says that you get your licence back for those categories quoted, UNLESS it was a test taken in an automatic car. In other words, if you take your test in a manual car, you get categories B + E, C, C + E, D and D + E back. If you take your test in an automatic, they you don't.
This does not affect what 35(1)b and section 35 (3) say about all classes that were previously held being returned to you. They say you get your licence back for ALL categories in column 2 of Schedule 1...... (Which includes category A, motor cycles) you cannot do what they have done and read section 4 in isolation!

i would suggest that you you copy and paste this to "the guy in the know, and his colleague and ask them to reconsider!


Entitlement upon passing a test following disqualification until tested under Article 152 or 196 of the Order


35. (1) Where a person—


(a)is disqualified by order of a court under Article 152 or 196 of the Order until tested; and
(b)passes the driving test prescribed in respect of a class of motor vehicles included in any category,
the disqualification shall be deemed to have expired in relation to that class and such other classes of motor vehicle as are specified in paragraphs (2), (3) and (4).


(2) Subject to paragraph (4), the disqualification shall be deemed to have expired in relation to all classes of vehicle included in the category or sub-category referred to in paragraph (1)(b) unless—


(a)the test or, as the case may be, the practical test is passed on a motor vehicle with automatic transmission, in which case the disqualification shall be deemed to have expired only in relation to such classes of vehicle included in that category or sub-category as have automatic transmission;
(b)the practical test is passed on an invalid carriage, in which case the disqualification shall be deemed to have expired in relation only to invalid carriages;
(c)the test or, as the case may be, the practical test, is passed on a motor vehicle which is adapted on account of a disability of the person taking the test, in which case the disqualification shall be deemed to have expired only in relation to such classes of motor vehicle included in that category or sub-category as are so adapted (and for the purposes of this paragraph, a motor bicycle with a side-car may be treated as an appropriate case as a motor vehicle adapted on account of a disability).
(3) The disqualification shall be deemed to have expired in relation to all classes of vehicle included in any other category which is specified in column (2) of Schedule 1 as being an additional category or sub-category in relation to that category or sub-category unless—


(a)the test or, as the case may be, the practical test is passed on a vehicle with automatic transmission, in which case the disqualification shall be deemed to have expired only in relation to such classes of motor vehicle included in the additional category or sub-category as have automatic transmission;
(b)the practical test is passed on an invalid carriage, in which case the disqualification shall be deemed to have expired only in relation to invalid carriages;
(c)the test or, as the case may be, the practical test, is passed on a vehicle which is adapted on account of a disability of the person taking the test, in which case the disqualification shall be deemed to have expired only in relation to such classes of motor vehicle included in the additional category or sub-category as are so adapted.
(4) Where the person who is disqualified passes the practical test on a vehicle of a class included in category B the disqualification shall be deemed to have expired additionally in relation to all classes of vehicle included in—


(a)categories B + E, C, C + E, D and D + E unless that test is passed on a vehicle with automatic transmission, in which case the disqualification shall be deemed to have expired only in relation to such classes of motor vehicle included in those categories as have automatic transmission; and
(b)categories F, G, H, K, L and P.
(5) Where a person is, pursuant to regulation 45, disqualified by the Department until he passes a driving test prescribed in respect of a class of large goods or passenger-carrying vehicle, the disqualification shall not be deemed to have expired in relation to any class of large goods or passenger-carrying vehicle until he passes that test.
 
John, that is an excellent analysis of the legislation and I see exactly the point you are making. It makes sense too. I will indeed send it to them and see what they have to say. Thank you, and I will keep you informed if/when they choose to reply to me. In many ways this is becoming a point of principle to me and I do not like the thought of being marginalised further than I already have.
 
Enter code DRINKDRIVING10 during checkout for 10% off
Top