High Risk Offenders Scheme - Drink Driving Help Needed TIA

Convicted Driver Insurance

bignik

New Member
Hi,

would anyone know or be able to supply a link regarding the period of time the HROs is applicable for. It is being mentioned by DVLA to me regarding an Offence 25 to 30 years ago.

Since then I have never had as much as a parking ticket.

Thanks in anticipation cause Im scratching my baldy head LOL :)
 
Te HRO scheme dates from 1983, but at that point was only for being 2.5 times or more over the legal limit or failing to supply.
In 1991 the offence of 2 disqualifications in 10 years was added to the scheme, so depending on which category you fell into it has been in place for at least 27 years.....
it doesn’t matter how much time has elapsed since your ban has finished, even 20-30 years......the rules say that you have to complete a medical before getting your licence back after a ban if you are in the HRO category.
 
Hi, so basically its a life long blemish then. Jings didnt think that long, basically last year I got stopped on M6, no charges, clear breathalyser, he let me on my way knowing that was 200 miles away and my already travelled 300 miles. 2 months later asked to take medical which I did 6 days it was after receiving letter I thought it was physical because I am disabled. Dont drink anymore they revoked my Licence saying CDT test indicated a level of alcohol abuse and I was just dumbfounded. Now I also have a iron blood disorder which I attend hospital for and have done so for last 12 years, they do full liver test ggt, acv,mcv etc etc, my haematologist says its nonsense all my results clearly show I'm a non drinker and have been as long as attending hospital. So they have 1 test, hospital has nearly 50 tests. She says to me tell DVLA to get in touch I cant give out information and send to them, I can only do that under NHS Rules do so if asked by GP or the likes of DVLA, so I write to DVLA they say the medical was because they got a form from the policeman ( Interceptor so no fool ) and as I was on HRO scheme hence medical. I tell them to contact my heamotologist who will supply contrary info to their CDT test, asked them for copy of results, what biomarkers were used and traceability to make sure sample was mine and not a mix up. They are refusing . they say get them to contact us, hospital say they cant... I have now got a solicitor on it , But Im just peeved as well as lost what Ive alledgedly done or whats gone wrong .... Im sure you will understand we know if we drink or dont , yes I had history but it was years ago. As to why , what can I do and why do they get to play God with my life when in reality I haven't done anything wrong.

As mention I'm disabled, I cannot even get out my house, I cant even walk sober what would I be like drunk , the physical side of things they already know of, no Motorway Interceptor Cop if in doubt would let a driver continue his journey be it drink drugs or mobility ... they dont mention the other two, just Alcohol.
 
Sorry but I am finding your post a bit confusing.
Can we break it down a bit.....

You asked about the HRO scheme. That relates to people who have been caught drink driving under the reasons I stated before, 2 convictions in 10 years, fail to supply or 2.5 times or more over the legal limit. Are you saying that years ago you committed an offence (s) that put you in this category? If so, then you should not have driven until you had applied for your licence back after you ban, and then DVLA would have required you to have a medical.
If that was the case though, I would have expected the police officer last year to have started proceedings against you for driving without a licence and no insurance. Did that happen? If not he was being very kind to you!

Moving on to when you were stopped, you blew clear on the breath test, so what was the basis of the report from the police officer to DVLA? It couldn’t have been for drinking, could it have been about your medical fitness to drive from what he saw of your disabilities? Is your vehicle adapted to suit them?

It it can be very frustrating dealing with DVLA, if you can be clearer about what the circumstances are (and space the detail out more to be easier to read) then I can perhaps offer some advice on what you need to do.
 
Hi again Price and thank you for your patience, Im not a big user of forums

hope this helps

HRO scheme dvla told me was referring to a drink driving incident over 25 years ago,
which I am aware of just didnt think would come up 25 years later to be held against
me in relation to this

When stopped by police breathalysed, it was clear . When if took Drugs I told officer
I took prescribed medication which was dvla approved and also advised by my doctor
as being ok. When mobility issue changes of medication is always a big must to
get checked as no car one basically has no legs.

He said fine ok and let me continue my journey of further 200 miles home.

2 months later a request from dvla to attend medical with my GP and Specialist then after those an Independant
GP did an Independant Medical. They stated it was due to a police report.

So not drinking nothing to hide, no charges relating to anything I was somewhat confused when
they advised me of the failure on the cdt test. They advised me I was dependant on alcohol and
the reading suggested I was drinking 14 Pints of Lager or similar a day for a period of 2/4 weeks.

I was gobsmacked as Im sure you can imagine. For eight weeks I kept asking them about this
alleged report as for me there was nothing ( and in reality there isnt ), told them I couldnt afford
such a habit sent them my bank statement in and out for six months which is benefit based and
my disposable income was only 160.00 a month of which about half of that I spent on fuel to
get about. I do voluntary work so no time to consume such a hugh amount of alcohol and in addition
told them speaking to my local pharmacy who had advised me drinking that much alcohol with
my prescribed medication I would be lucky not to be comatosed never mind being able to see
passed my steering wheel. I sent them a letter from my consultant ref my genetic condition and his suggestion
that they contact her for full details. This they havent done and are claiming medications or
my Generic disorder would have no effect on CDT test and no adverse affects on my blood test
and the results it yielded.

I sent them a copy of a report on CDT that was written by a Mr Roy Sherwood of Kings Hospital
in London on the test and methods. He states in abnormal circumstances test should be taken
in isolation, one every two weeks, to be 100% another on week 6, medical abnormalities should
be taken into consideration. I also found out the company that carries out the tests for DVLA
is a company called Viapath. the sane Roy Sherwood is a director of aforementioned company.
I also sent several copies of documentation available on web by Roy Sherwood and find he
was actually involved with the test coming into force, some papers on my condition which
clearly stated it highly influenced the test also. She has over 40 indvidual full liver test results
going back 12 years when I first was diagnosed my blood disorder. Shes working Ive got
44 negative tests for alcohol vs 1 possitive cdt test no not possible

Again I asked them to take another test which would have to be taken with certain biofactors
because of my condition, this was what my heamotologist advised as again she couldnt intervene
as it was dvla, and dvla would have to contact her with instructions. They were also asked
what testing method was used and what were the biomarkers they had used. All having an
important part of a possible false positive, which is rare but she told me does happen.
So very confused now and angry demanded to see what data the had under the freedom of information
act that had caused all this about.

I got a 2 page copy of a D751 Form Notification of possible medical driving condition driving
incidents only.

It basically a hand completed form by the police officer , name address dvla no etc.
Date of the incident and cause of the incident. Cause was stated as Erratic Driving.

It was a Thursday , 5.30 pm I had entered M6 at J20 and was stopped between J22/23,
Traffic was crawling due to roadworks and I was frustrated and dawdling along M6
stop start at no more than 10/15mph. Even though he claims this no mention no
caution and no charges. Also like to add traffic that slow he approached and pulled me in from
the inside lane approaching my vehicle from Hard Shoulder.

Then witnesses, time of incident, collision, evidence was driver taken to hospital, all
tick boxes empty

The form then has the Constables Name and Number and where's he's stationed.

It does states at foot of form an asterisk * He has be arrested in the past
for drink driving. This obviously going back 25 years and the HRO scheme.

So why the test in first place ? Yes I did get my Licence back25 + years ago
which since no convictions, not even a parking ticket. What did I do wrong ?

Why wont they investigate the CDT issue, from the reports Ive read, yes
its accurate but only to 94%, I even have that claim confirmed by them
in a reply letter from DVLA.

Whats happening to this 6%, I believe its about 60,000 HROs, thats
360 false tests.

Hope a little easier on the eyes, I suffer same problem having a large screen

Thanks In Anticipation.

Oh sorry I forgot to mention it was passed to the Medical Dept, Complex Cases
for review when I sent them my health related documents and plea for help.

That was a wast of time they just sent a duplicate letter of a letter was sent prior
 
Ok, things are a bit more clear now.
This is nothing to do with the HRO scheme as you do not have 2 convictions within 10 years. It is about DVLA receiving a report suggesting that they should investigate your fitness to drive. This can come from a police officer or a medical person.

I am wondering why the officer selected you to check out of all the many vehicles in that slow moving traffic? I would imagine that there must have been something about how you were driving for him to do this......
I am puzzled as to why he would report you about a drink problem if you were clear on a breath test. I would have thought that it was more about medication and physical fitness to drive, and then DVLA called you for a medical. You have then fallen foul of a (false) CDT reading that they have then used as grounds to revoke your licence.
I would have thought that they would have reconsidered in the light of the evidence that you have supplied about your history of liver function tests. The problem is, though, that DVLA abandoned those tests several years ago because the CDT test is a more reliable indicator of alcohol abuse. (although, as you say, even those are not 100%)

You should ask DVLA for your actual CDT score. For your information, a score of 2.3-2.9 is an amber result that warrants further investigation. A score of 3 or above is a fail. I am not sure who said it was the equivalent of 14 pints of lager but that is up to 1 1/2 bottles of whiskey a day so, if true would certainly trigger a high score. In a way, the higher the score, the more likely it is to support your claim that it is your blood disorder that has caused it.
I think your your next step should be to get an independent CDT test done. That way you are challenging the DVLA result ‘like for like’. If your GP is well aware of your history the. I would hope that they would do this for you as a part of ongoing monitoring. You could resort to a Medichecks home testing kit but because DVLA have dug their heels in, it would be better to have an ‘official’ test result.
Only then, if that is high as well, do you start to argue the medical angle that your condition is causing this. If it is low, you have direct evidence to contradict their result.

If it is high, Maybe your consultant would be willing to provide an assessment of your liver health based on the Child-Pugh score. This is referenced in research into the impact of liver disorders that can have an impact on CDT scores. It is American research, but adds to your claim that the score is not produced by alcohol abuse. You seem to have done quite a bit of research into this but I will provide links below to the research document and to the NHS explanation of the Child-Pugh score. You will see that the research shows that a score of 10+ is significant in the production of a high CDT score.....

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4700931/

https://www.sps.nhs.uk/wp-content/u..._is_the_Child-Pugh_score_update_May_2017.docx

You say that you are speaking with a solicitor. You will need one because if DVLA will not reconsider then your only recourse is to ask for a hearing at the magistrates court to challenge the DVLA decision to revoke your licence. That is the only mechanism to appeal. In that hearing you would want to put forward either your own CDT result to contradict theirs, or medical evidence to support why the CDT is consistently high.
 
Hi Price , thanks very helpful, to clarify some of the points your struggling with due to my lack of information
I have pulled out my copy correspondence.

Stopped M6 whilst travelling between J20 and J19, stuck in rush hour traffic in the inside lane.

Police Interceptor pulled me into hard shoulder, him approaching my vehicle via travelling along
the hard shoulder. Not sure but I feel perhaps he had been sitting on the raised layby for
emergency services.

My car was full of 4 large tyres which was my reason for travelling as being disable enjoy
the country etc. and all terrain tyres suited for this purpose. It is a small car I own so
perhaps them showing maybe thought stolen wheels or something.

The form he sent to DVLA I was sent a copy of, it states under section 2 Type of
Incident. Erratic Driving is ticked. Section 3 Straight Road is ticked

Section D1 , medical conditions which may appear responsible for incident.
Drugs and Alcohol is ticked. Yes despite Breathaliser being negative and
Drugs I take being approved by my Psychiatrist and GP.

Was road test carried out .. No, any other relevant information (Left Blank), Section related to
drugs prescribed drugs is ticked and alcohol is ticked, next to that is an asterisk and he has
hand written Has been arrested previously for drunk driving. Which was 25 years ago as
only offence.

Witnesses NO , evidence NO Has driver surrendered his licence NO

and thats it without sending a photocopy of it, the Form is D751

The erratic driving I claim was ridiculous and I told police officer at time
was since entering the motorway and been stopped I had been crawling
no more than 10/15 mph in inside lane. But I suspect usual, they have to
have a reason to stop this was perhaps his way to investigate whatever
prompted him to stop me. Now in all fairness the Policeman was a very nice
chap no sarcasm nothing and I was calm , answered all his questions, told
him of my background, after his radio check explained to him what had happened
etc . Im gob smacked to this day to find out he was source of it all.

Now the police have a duty of care to not only a suspect but also the general
public. There is no way in this world a interceptor policeman would allow
a erratic driver under the influence of any alcohol or any drugs, continue
their Journey of 200 miles home. Absolutely nil chance, probably risk his own
career if did so.So the report I dont know , or understand, nor will DVLA
confirm to me.

I live in Scotland, so appeal is actually 21 days not 6 months as north of the
Border is. I set that in motion as it took DVLA 2 weeks to respond to my
letter asking what the heck was going on. So not to tempt fate asked my solicitor
to immediately lodge appear at local Sheriff Court which he did , DVLA asked for
it to sisted I think the term is, basically halted until they could get a Solicitor
in Glasgow.

DVLA also fell out with me I feel, sent me a letter stating this was going to cost me
a lot of money etc. I would have to pay their costs etc

Basically scare tactics, but anyway my response was an innocent man has
nothing to hide. So I've been doing research sending them this and that to prove
my case, get no reply , or they send me letter with no meaning, help or
advise.

They have had correspondence from GP, Psychiatrist and Heamotologist
supporting my claim. Again nope nothing from DVLA

Oh the CDT test they claim was 3.8% when I told them it meant nothing to
me they claim it represents daily consumption of 14 Pints Lager on a
daily and long term basis.

This was when I sent them copy bank statements showing my incomings and
outgoings, disposable income from my Benefits to show them I would
even be able to finance such a habit or feed that quoted consumption

Im sure your reached for the asprin by now, but it is very much appreciated
very good site. I wish I had come across it sooner.
 
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