Insurance advice

Convicted Driver Insurance

NyssaDark

Member
I have recently been caught drink driving and worried what's going to happen

I'm the named driver on my dad's insurance policy. I very rarely drive the car but was just stupid on this incident.

My insurance renewal is coming up soon and he wants to re new me on his policy but doesn't know I'll be disqualified when he re news it and unless I tell the insurers they won't know either

I don't plan on driving the car whatsoever as I hardly did anyway but if he does re new it will he find out I'm banned or will I have to tell him in order to tell the insurance company


Help
 
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No one will know. I'm still insured on my wifes car and i've been banned now for just over 2 years.
I can't see any reason anyone would bother about it, Unless you drove the car.
It's just my opinion, But i really wouldn't worry about it.
 
Okay - I'm curious then.

I would never drive the car obviously but an anpr would only pick up my dad when he's driving it then. Not me?
 
The insurance company won't know anything unless you tell them.
The ANPR will come up as insured.
My wife has been pulled on many occasions, This is because of my driving whilst disqualifed convictions, So the car was flagged.
She's had no problems at all, They simply stopped the car to check i wasn't driving. This was nothing to do with me being on her insurance. A neighbour had reported me for driving.
 
Nyssadark,
this has now raised several questions.
ANPR checks the vehicle, not the driver, against the Insurance companies database, so if your dad has insured the vehicle it will NOT flag up on ANPR irrespective of who is driving.
When your dad insures the vehicle, he has an obligation to disclose ALL material facts, or it risks voiding the cover, or reducing it to basic required 3 rd party cover. This includes any criminal convictions, points or disqualifications the past 5 years. I know you appear to be planning to not tell your dad, so HE couldn't tell the insurance company, and you say, obviously, that you do not plan to drive the car..... but what happens in a years time when you will then be driving the car? You will be disclosing a conviction that is a year old, and the insurance company will take a dim view of the non disclosure.
Do you really think you will get through the year without your dad finding out? There may be times, say, when he has a hospital appointment, can't drive himself so asks you to take him. Lie your way out of it, of keep quiet and drive him? You will have a year of deceit, then have to tell him anyway.
Another reason for disclosing to the insurance company is that their quote is based on ALL the details of the policy, which includes their being 2 drivers, and for the next year there can only be one. An insurance policy is often lower where there are 2 drivers, because they can share the driving. In your case this might be different, as you are the son! But have already pointed this out to Europhil in another thread, yet he has quoted his own circumstances to you as justification for not disclosing relevant information to the insurance company.
In his case, it is wife and spouse insurance, which it very likely to be higher for just the wife, yet he has not told his insurers. I will leave it to him to work out how he will tell the insurance company about his drink drive conviction, plus 2 drive whilst disqualified, one of which was in his wife's car, (presumably charged with no insurance as well?) when he gets his licence back this year.
One final note, that again I have pointed out to Europhil before, is that in the near future the link between DVLA and the insurers database will become 2 way. At the moment DVLA can check to see if a vehicle is insured. Soon the insurers database will be able to check with DVLA if a person has correctly disclosed points or disqualifications. Bearing in mind that these details are disclosable for 5 years, there could be a lot of people facing BIG problems when it is found out who has lied about their situation during that period of time.
When anyone on a public forum offers an opinion, it can pay to look at their previous posts to help judge how valid / accurate that opinion is. I am happy for you to look at my past posts to see where the genuine advice is coming.
so in short, bite the bullet and tell your dad. he will be angry, but you will not have to worry about dishonesty for a year - then telling him anyway and often, once the parental anger is over, you my ell find that he is supportive. Mistakes do happen, the important thing is to learn from them, not not make things worse.

one final thing, as I see that Eurphil has replied while I have been composing this, he says that his wife has been stopped several times to see if he was driving, imagine what the officer says when he stops your dad...: " oh it is father of Mr X driving, we were just stopping the vehicle to see in mr X was driving because he is a convicted drink driver." Cat is out of the bag......!
 
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What you said makes total sense

I just get confused about ANPR and how the entire thing works.

So they would be able to see that the names driver was banned despite the main driver having no convictions?

They didn't know I was part of the insurance until they manually entered who I was in relation to the Insured car
 
I fully agree with Price1367 on this.

Insurance must be spot on or you potentially could get your dad and yourself in a lot of trouble. This would undoubtedly affect him financially as insurance companies do not like being deceived. Its not a risk worth taking as its not just your risk your taking. There are too many 'what if' scenarios, it really is not worth it.

If the issue is your dad finding out then do everything you can not to be a named driver on his policy, any excuse will do.

In reality you have 2 options:

1. Convince your dad that you dont want to be a named driver.

2. If that fails, you will have to come clean before he names you on the policy.
 
NyssaDark said:
What you said makes total sense

I just get confused about ANPR and how the entire thing works.

So they would be able to see that the names driver was banned despite the main driver having no convictions?

They didn't know I was part of the insurance until they manually entered who I was in relation to the Insured car
Click to expand...

People see programmes on American TV whee a check of a car number plate shows the registered owner and at the same time what convictions he has. and presume it is right, it may be there, but certainly not for England.
Here, the ANPR shows if a vehicle is insured, or more to the point it flags up a warning if it scans a licence plate against which no insurance is shown. It does NOT show if the insurance is third party only or comprehensive. It does not show if only the policy holder is covered or there are named drivers. It does not even show if the driver is insured, because ANPR does not know who the driver is, only the police who stop you know that when they ask for the identity of the driver. They can then ask the insurance company to confirm if the driver is covered under the terms of the policy.
 
Ah okay

This is very interesting. So as long as the car is insured has tax mot etc etc they don't actually know who is driving the car. Even if it's just a main policy holder? Disqualified or not? Ultimately until they pull you over for whatever reason and ask who you are.
 
ANPR may be covered for you (at the moment) in respect to being caught but who knows if the Police would dig deeper? Also, should your dad have an accident and make a claim or a claim be made against him thats where it could get ugly. As any accident cannot be predicted, its not a risk worth taking especially as your dad is the innocent party here.

As much as he might be angry about your conviction I am sure he would be furious if his policy was cancelled after a crash and he was liable financially. It would also make insurance more expensive for him for x number of years as well as potentially a conviction for no insurance which is 6 points and a £300 fine.

Although I have highlighted the extremes there are far too many 'what ifs' here so do either option 1 or 2 in my last post.
 
No no I completely understand. I'm just interested in how it all works.

Believe me I'm accessing my 2 options!

Would an anpr pick up a disqualified driver then if he was the MAIN policy holder even if the cars insured, taxed or just notice that the car is insured, taxed etc etc.
 
NyssaDark said:
No no I completely understand. I'm just interested in how it all works.

Believe me I'm accessing my 2 options!

Would an anpr pick up a disqualified driver then if he was the MAIN policy holder even if the cars insured, taxed or just notice that the car is insured, taxed etc etc.
Click to expand...

I wouldnt want to say 100% but it probably wouldnt pick up a disqualified driver if insurance, tax and MOT were all in order. However an ANPR also can also show 'intelligence' reports of cars suspected of being involved in crime. If a disqualified driver had been caught before it would definitely be logged as such.

Sometimes disqualified drivers are recognised at the wheel.

The problem is once stopped (for any reason) its then down to the driver to prove they are entitled to drive.

I dont advocate lying but in your case is there another reason you can give your dad as to why you dont want to be on the renewal?
 
ukboxer said:
I wouldnt want to say 100% but it probably wouldnt pick up a disqualified driver if insurance, tax and MOT were all in order. However an ANPR also can also show 'intelligence' reports of cars suspected of being involved in crime. If a disqualified driver had been caught before it would definitely be logged as such.

Sometimes disqualified drivers are recognised at the wheel.

The problem is once stopped (for any reason) its then down to the driver to prove they are entitled to drive.

I dont advocate lying but in your case is there another reason you can give your dad as to why you dont want to be on the renewal?
Click to expand...


Yes I agree with you ukboxer,

I have been reliably told that like you said ANPR does show more than just insurance details. My understanding is that if you are stopped for DD in a car, regardless if your insurance is in order an ANPR number plate check will highlight the fact the vehicle has been pulled for a DD offence and the driver will be questioned.

Price1367 says that convictions related to the vehicle do not show up on a ANPR but I think we probably need clarification of this from a police officer unless Mr Price1367 can tell me any different. . .
 
uklegendman said:
Yes I agree with you ukboxer,

I have been reliably told that like you said ANPR does show more than just insurance details. My understanding is that if you are stopped for DD in a car, regardless if your insurance is in order an ANPR number plate check will highlight the fact the vehicle has been pulled for a DD offence and the driver will be questioned.

Price1367 says that convictions related to the vehicle do not show up on a ANPR but I think we probably need clarification of this from a police officer unless Mr Price1367 can tell me any different. . .
Click to expand...

I dont think the initial DD would appear on an ANPR however, should someone be stopped and found to be driving whilst disqualified I see no reason why those vehicle details would not then be added to the ANPR as a vehicle of interest (i.e involved in crime) if that makes sense.

As you say, I am open to clarification also and by no means an expert on the subject.
 
You have heard from a police officer..... I was one for 30 years!
ANPR shows up car document details, and a persons convictions are recorded on PNC - the Police National Computer. The two are not linked, except for vehicle details which can be placed there.
Therefore when the ANPR 'pings' it is because the vehicle has a problem with its documentation, or it is suspected of illegal use, not that the driver has a problem.
Additional 'markers' can be added by the police to a registration number, which is recorded on the PNC such as suspected drugs involvement, or 'seen is suspicious circumstances near several house burglaries, if seen, please obtain occupants details.'
If you watch some of the 'reality TV' programmes (not that it is a good idea if you are thinking of a career in the police!) you will see the ANPR in action occasionally. It is the device that you often see going "Yaba Daba Doooo..... When the warning goes off, I guarantee you will never see it go off with the warning : "convicted drink driver." onscreen.

Having stopped you, the police will ask your name and date of birth, then they can interrogate the PNC persons check section to see what convictions you have, or if you are wanted.
If you want to read some more about ANPR, here is a link to a report about the failure of the system to pick up on a person wanted for murder, and rape, where a marker was put on his vehicle which 'pinged' a number of times over a five day period, and his vehicle was not even stopped then, due to not being sufficiently prioritised or no units available in the immediate area to respond.....
http://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/defaul...mmissioner_reports/ANPR Report to publish.pdf
So even if a vehicle is marked as of interest, it is graded as to the level of seriousness and depends on available resources. How high do you think a drink driving conviction would rate on their scale? There would have to be 60,000 vehicles a year added to the ANPR, and who would weed out the ones first that were in stolen cars or hired ones?
Ukboxer is probably right that continued use of the same vehicle to commit offences, as in drink driving, then driving whilst disqualified would warrant a marker being placed against the vehicle.
 
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Thanks for that Price1367.

Although worded slightly different we are certainly in agreement. Basically ANPR will check insurance, tax, MOT and any 'marker' that may be on that vehicle.

The OP is asking initially whether they are going to be stopped when they have insurance, tax and MOT and the answer is no, not from an ANPR.

On a side note, if someone is found to be a disqualified driver and subsequently convicted, is that likely to be added as a 'marker' for that vehicle?

EDIT - I think your edit answered that question ;)
 
I think I have given as much information as I feel comfortable giving, and we are in danger of thing to produce a guide to minimising the risk of being caught, which I will not do.
if a person drives whilst disqualified, the court takes a more serious view than if someone is caught without a licence. This is because the disqualified driver is defying a court order, not just breaking the law. They are also driving without insurance, which is unfair on other road users. It also increases the chance that they will fail to stop after accidents.
Drink drivers sometimes do not realise they are over the limit. Disqualified drivers almost invariably know they are banned, take their chances and do, deservedly, often face imprisonment and a longer ban when caught.
 
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